Misleading Psycho in The Psycho Ward Forum

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Misleading Psycho

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Saturday8pm		#141	[-]
May 3 12 11:13 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Mark Redfield wrote: I don't think Hitchcock's cheating. In hindsight, I think the intention and development is two-fold: Marion (and the audience) are lead to believe Mrs. Bates is a living invalid. The first time that we hear Mrs. Bates, Marion hears it as well (the arguement in the house before Norman returns with sandwiches). So this very much means that Norman is talking to himself, creating a voice for the mother. (Even knowing Norman's secret can add some eerieness to the scene. I watch the film now and can imaging Norman screaming at himself in the gloom of the old house on the hill...) But the (multiple) female voices we hear later are in Norman's head. The clue is the variation of voices. The last clue for me (that most of the mother dialogue is in Norman's head) has always been the voice that we/Norman hears at the very end of the picture. Mark Redfield www.redfieldarts.com Good point, Mark, it's the film's end scene that supports your conclusion. But, when Bates argues with his mother, is he mouthing his part, and imagining her part? More likely, since he's compelled to outbursts anyway, he's mouthing both parts in that scene, but since the argument is off-camera, we don't know. People often think aloud, and most likely argue aloud as well, even if it's imaginary. Kids do this with imaginary friends. Since Norman has been alone for years, it's seems realistic to assume he peppers his days with vocalizations to continue the illusion of family. All this comes from his head, and he makes it come alive. "Lord I love Spring! The birds, the fair weather, the new flowers. It doesn't get any better than this. HOLY CRAP! what's THAT?!?"
HitchcockFan		#142	[-]
Nov 15 12 3:16 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	test
HitchcockFan		#143	[-]
Nov 15 12 3:31 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	In the novel, Bloch actually describes Norman's chats with his Mother - obvioulsy when we find out the truth - that we know that Norman is his Mother, it is apparent that Bloch has been showing us projections of Norman's mind. Obviously this had to be changed for the film. The only times that another character hears Mother speaking, is when Marion hears the argument, when Norman screams "I'm Norma Bates" and when he thanks the policeman for the towel. The other two times we hear Mother speak, are when Norman is carrying her to the fruit cellar and at the end. That last time, is the only time we actually hear her and see Norman's face - and it is clearly in his imagination. I think the changes in voices are meant to signify Norman speaking as Mother and Norman imagining her speaking - living alone all of those years, is it possible that he is starting to forget what she sounds like, hence the changes?
Bobtheman	Concerning the premiere of Pyscho	#144	[-]
Dec 9 12 8:40 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psycho_(film) The film was so successful that it was reissued to theaters in 1965. A year later, CBSpurchased the television rights for $450,000. CBS planned to televise the film on September 23, 1966, but three days earlier, Valerie Percy, daughter of Illinois senate candidate Charles H. Percy, was murdered. As her parents slept mere feet away, she was stabbed a dozen times with a double-edged knife. In light of the murder, CBS agreed to postpone the screening, but as a result of the Apollo pad fire of January 27, 1967, the network washed its hands of Psycho,^[109] and shortly afterward Paramount included the film in its first syndicated package of post-1950 movies, "Portfolio I." WABC-TV in New York City was the first station in the country to air Psycho (with some scenes significantly edited), on its late-night movie series, The Best of Broadway, on June 24, 1967.^[111] Following another successful theatrical reissue in 1969, the film finally made its way to general television airing in one of Universal's syndicated programming packages for local stations in 1970. Psycho was aired for twenty years in this format, then leased to cable for two years before returning to syndication as part of the "List of a Lifetime" package.^[109^]I think I might have seen that premiere because before I even saw this Wikipedia article, ten minutes ago, I think I recall seeing Psycho on "The Best of Broadway" I was watching it with my brothers and mother, and we were wondering what to watch when it ended at 1:00 AM.And I think the Invisible Man was in progress on another station and so we turned that channel on. I could be mistaken, though. However, I do recall when I saw it that time, it did end at 1:00 AM. and we saw The Invisible Man, pun intended. It was over forty years ago. Concerning the footnotes that appear in that article, the link to one of them is from The New York Times June 1, 1967 http://select.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F60B14F9395E137A93C3A9178DD85F438685F9 WABC TO TONE DOWN PSYCHO JUNE 24TH WABC-TV in New York plans to show Alfred Hitchcock's "Psycho" on June 24. It will be the first time that the 1960 film about a homicidal psychopath will be telecast. Would like to touch upon the fact that Perkins was not the Mother figure in the shower scene , likely not in the window when Marion arrives at the motel, and not in the Arbogast murder. Was Hitchcock wrong in having someone other than Perkins be Mother in those scenes, when his character was supposed to be the one ? From Wikipedia "However, because of the possibility of audio dubbing in restorations and reissues of the film over the years, today it is unclear whether or not the sound of the toilet flushing was in the original 1959 release." Anyone here recall the 1959 thetare version having the flushing sound? I'll concede that on of the early pages of this thead it looked like I was talking to myself ( again).
Bobtheman		#145	[-]
Dec 9 12 9:14 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Here is a tereffic article on Pyscho regarding television how it was supposed to be on CBS and then actually premiered on ABC http://www.tvobscurities.com/articles/cbs_and_psycho/ the end of the article reads Psycho On WABC-TV Psycho eventually premiered on television in June of 1967 but not on CBS. Station WABC-TV in New York City broadcast Psycho on Saturday, June 24th, 1967 as part of its "The Best of Broadway" series. It aired from 11:30-1:45PM. According to The New York Times, the famous shower scene was cut from 12 stabs to three [25]. Well, my recollection of when it ended was 1;00 AM, maybe I'm off on that a bit. The article has lots of footnotes, and worth taking a look at.
ryanbrennan		#146	[-]
Dec 13 12 12:16 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Thanks for the additional info regarding the TV premiere of PSYCHO, Bob. Rick brought up the subject on page 1 of this thread and we started discussing the premiere in depth on page 2: http://monsterkidclassichorrorforum.yuku.com/topic/3751/Misleading-Psycho?page=2 with some cool newspaper reproductions by different board members, especially grgstv338. PSYCHO premiered on an ABC TV station but that wasn't exactly the same thing as premiering on ABC.
DonM435		#147	[-]
Jan 17 13 9:57 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I remember the network cancellation. The film first played Chicago TV on a late night (10:30 p.m. Central Time) showing some months later.
delgadosaur		#148	[-]
Jan 19 13 5:53 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Misdirection is a basic premise of filmmaking, and it's used all the time. There's a Jason Bourne film where you cut from a backlit Matt Damon to another character, then when you cut back its another actor. The guy dressing as a girl situation is filled with cutbacks to and from people wearing the same costume, but worn by an actor of a different gender. I mean, a whole film IS an artificial construct, right?
sladdin.whirligigtv		#149	[-]
Jan 26 13 6:53 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Psycho seen it many times still enjoy the thrill.
delgadosaur		#150	[-]
Mar 3 13 4:31 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	The dialogue between Norman and himself as his mom is really interesting...
Lawrence Fechtenberger		#151	[-]
Apr 30 13 9:54 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	For what it is worth: At the 6:10 point, this shows the opening for "The CBS Friday Night Movies" (1967)--a montage of posters, one of which is for PSYCHO.
Bobtheman		#152	[-]
May 2 13 8:02 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	post 141 "But, when Bates argues with his mother, is he mouthing his part, and imagining her part? More likely, since he's compelled to outbursts anyway, ..." No, I don't think he's imagining her part, as Marion overhears the argument and says words o the effect that if anyone talked to her the way she talked to Norman ( I'm paraphrasing) during their visit in the parlor. The psychiatrist also says that Norman would dress up as his mother, talk in her voice, have conversations.... The only time when it's internal, just thinking, not talking, is at the end of the film, when he is alone, and his lips are not moving. Seems to me the early part of the conversation Marion overhears is "missing"... it picks up with Mother saying "No! I tell you No...". etc. et there had to be something before that. Some of the still photographs show Marion, Sam, and Lila all min the same photo... was this misleading because all three characters were never in any one scene? Or was Hitchcock taking artistic license in doing so? Another issue with the film is that eventually Sam marries Lila, they have a daughter Mary. But in the afterworld, when we shuffle off this mortal coil ,wouldn't this create an awkward situation between the three characters? Marion loved Sam, and now Sam married her sister.... Last Edited By: Bobtheman May 3 13 4:53 PM. Edited 1 times.
Lawrence Fechtenberger		#153	[-]
May 3 13 7:36 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Bobtheman wrote: Some of the still photographs show Marion, Sam, and Lila all min the same photo... was this misleading because all three characters were never in any one scene? Or was Hitchcock taking artistic license in doing so? The general rule with publicity photos is to show the stars in an interesting manner. Accurately representing the film is optional.
Ted Newsom		#154	[-]
May 3 13 3:02 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Well, gee... there were pictures with Hitchcock and an empty canvas-back chair with the stenciled name, "Mrs. Bates." Gosh! That's cheating!
Bobtheman		#155	[-]
May 3 13 4:55 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I believe that Hitchcock circulated publicity that he was casting for the role of Mrs. Bates.
Ted Newsom		#156	[-]
May 3 13 7:46 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Good lord. It's ALL a big conjuring trick, a cinematic joke. It's done brilliantly, but it's a sly leg-pull. Of COURSE he's going to cheat.
Monsterpal		#157	[-]
May 3 13 9:23 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	You mean it wasn't all true?
Bobtheman	Why Anthony Perkins was doubled	#158	[-]
May 7 13 12:54 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0054215/trivia?ref_=tt_trv_trv The shower scene has over 90 splices in it, and did not involve Anthony Perkins at all. Contrary to popular belief it wasn't due to a scheduling conflict Perkins had for the Broadway musical 'Greenville' but actually a deliberate decision on Alfred Hitchcock's part. On this subject Perkins states "Hitchcock was very worried that the dual role and nature of Norman Bates would be exposed if I were to appear in that scene. I think it was the recognizability of my silhouette, which is rather slim and broad in the shoulder. That worried him." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psycho_(1960_film) Anne Dore was chosen by Alfred Hitchcock to double for Anthony Perkins in the shower sequence in Psycho, since he did not want any of Perkins's physicality to betray his identity at that point in the film. Dore wore the mother's costume and did all the stabbing actions.

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Misleading Psycho