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May 7 13 1:53 AM
they do not appear to be the same newspaper
May 7 13 1:57 AM
this looks like an uncropped version of the still, and it looks like there is a reflection of someone's face in the area behind Arbogast.Explanation?
May 7 13 1:05 PM
May 7 13 1:08 PM
The Psycho Guide: A Comprehensive Guide to Hitchcock’s Classic Shocker by Joseph
After tracking the bedroom across to the money , the camera
again pans right and looks out the window at the Bates house- but the shot of
the house, with Norman coming out the
front door , was filmed separately and projected on a screen outside the window; this the timing of this forward track and pan
had to be perfectly synchronized with the existing footage of Norman.
May 7 13 1:16 PM
We have all heard about how a melon was sued for the slashing effect in the shower sequence.This is from
On the other hand, Danny Greene, an uncredited sound editor on
the film - told Skerry in no uncertain terms that he used beef. That story is
not well known – yet it seems credible not only because of Greene’s job title
but also because he claims to have done the stabbing himself. Here is Greene’s account:
“ We had changed the stabbing sound three times, but they still didn’t work … I
was going to the closest market, buy a big roast beef, and stab it in front of
a microphone… The prop guy said “Here, you might take the same knife we used in the scene …” So, I get this
giant chunk of meat, a big roast with gristle on the side. I stabbed it about
fifty times, in the gristle and the meat part. It was just a vicious sound of
slicing meat .. and the new stab sounds were a hit! Hitchcock leaned back in
his chair and said “Ah, yes- very nice” Melons were never used on any way to
create sound effects for Psycho. (Skerry, 232-233)
Anyone like the roast beef story?
Yet, there’s still a surprise for Psycho veterans when the
curtain pulls back and Mother raises her
knife: Mom is right handed - but the earlier scenes show Norman is a leftie.
A door prize to first person to point out where Norman is shown to be left handed earlier in the film.
The censors did force Hitchcock to excise an overhead shot of Marion’s fall ; it
showed her body from the back, draped over the edge of the tub , with her
buttocks clearly exposed. Psycho’s assistant editor,Terry Williams, told Skerry
all the outtakes from the shower scene were blithely – and tragically –thrown away
by an irritated shop steward who didn’t
want to sort and label the pieces. A still of this omitted image is reproduced in Skerry’s book – and Gus Von Saint included
this shot complete with the slash marks
on Marion’s back , in his 1998 remake.
Shame those outtakes are gone- any chance other outtakes might exist, I've read about multiple takes on the opening scene with Marion and Sam.
May 7 13 1:18 PM
May 7 13 1:29 PM
There are varying
accounts whether Leigh was in the shower the entire time or a body double was
used for some parts of the murder sequence and its aftermath. In an interview with
Roger Ebert and in Alfred Hitchcock and in the book The Making of Psycho, Leigh stated she was in
the scene the entire time and Hitchcock only used a stand-in for the sequence
in which Norman wraps Marion's body in a shower curtain and places it in the
trunk of her car. The 2010 book The Girl in Alfred
Hitchcock's Shower by Robert Graysmith contradicts this, identifying Marli Renfro as
Leigh's body double for some of the shower scene's shots.
The Psycho Guide: A Comprehensive Guide to Hitchcock’s Classic Shocker by Joseph
concerning the excised footage from shower mentioned in earlier post in this thread
The body in that shot wasn’t Leigh’s , of course; virtually no major star in that era would
have appeared fully and visibly nude in a film. Rather Leigh in that frame is
doubled by a 23-yeard old dancer named Marli Renfro; she was hired, because, as
Hitchcock puts it , "I want someone whose job is to be naked on the set”(Rebello
104). Renfro was used mostly for testing how various shots would work – and as a body
double when Norman wraps up Marion’s corpse later on. Leigh always insisted
that no shot of Renfro appears in the finished scene except the early blurred
view of Marion behind the translucent curtain. Krohn’s book, however indicates that well over four hours of shooting
took place with Renfro alone, without Leigh
present on the set. Renfro, for example , must certainly be the one who
appears in the aforementioned shots that show Marion’s breasts , however briefly.Psycho
expert Stepehen Rebello indicates that stand in Ann Dore was used in the overhead
shots of Marion fending off Mom’s knife. He also tells that Hitchcock himself
was the one who held the knife in many of the shots throughout the shower scene.
So we have conflicting information from Leigh and there may have been two stand ins for Leigh, Renfro and Dore.
Speaking of stand-ins, Anthony Perkins was in New York
preparing for a Broadway stage show when the shower scene was filmed. Mother in
this scene was played by veteran doubler Margo Epper , and by the above
mentioned Dore , whose face was blackened so as not to be seen clearly , though
her “burning eyes, dimly visible in some
prints, add a horrible touch when she
tears open the curtain.”( Krohn 230).
Information here says Mother in the stabbing was played by both Margo Epper and Ann Dore. This means Ann Dore may have done Mother in some parts and Marion in other parts. I postedthe shower video for reference., but for the life of me I don't see any " burning eyes" of mother. Has anyone seen "burning eyes?"
May 7 13 4:23 PM
I would say this is not a small person being carried by Norman down the stairsThis article also reads: In Psycho, the shots of Margo Epper, the actress who played Mother in the shower scene, had to be retouched as well, but the work here is subtle and doesn’t call attention to itself.http://cinefantastiqueonline.com/2010/10/author-stephen-rebello-on-the-making-of-psycho-a-celebration-of-1960-retrospective/Stephen Rebello interviewHitchcock also hired a nude model to shoot the entire sequence just in case Janet Leigh’s modesty made her guard her body and ruin the shot. That model, Marli Renfro, is definitely visible in the overhead shots.Anthony Perkins was not used in the scene in any way; he was already in rehearsals for a Frank Loesser musical on Broadway. Hitchcock wanted to spare Perkins any discomfort or embarrassment and, besides, Perkins had such a distinctive body type that he would have been recognized immediately by audiences. “Mother” was played in the scene by stuntwoman Margo Epper, whose face was blacked-out with makeup to conceal her identity. The sound of the knife stabbing flesh was accomplished by stabbing a casaba melon and also a slab of meat.Note: This appears to conflict with a prior post on this thread in which Rebelllo is quoted as saying that Ann Dore was used in the overhead shots of Marion fending off Mon's knife.http://www.filmschoolrejects.com/features/33-things-we-learned-from-the-psycho-commentary.phpThe shower scene included several body doubles because Perkins was rehearsing a Broadway play at the time. Stuntwoman Margo Epper played the Mother who draws open the shower curtain. Actress Anne Doran plays the Mother in the overhead stabbing shots. Playboy model Marli Renfro, who had the same physical dimensions as Janet Leigh, served as a body double for the actress so Hitchcock could set up his cameras wherever he wanted them without having to deal with modesty issues. Finally, Hitchcock held the knife during the close shots because he knew exactly where he wanted it to go.Saul Bass storyboards for the shower are shown herehttp://badassdigest.com/2012/10/22/saul-bass-and-hitchcocks-psycho-shower-scene/Quote from Rebello's book-Although Hitchcock would use other doubles to represent mother in the film, Epper claimed "When you see here with the knife, that's me."http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/1988-09-26/lifestyle/0070170242_1_bates-motel-epper-alfred-hitchcock-psychoFor the unforgettable shower scene, it was Margo Epper who approached Janet Leigh with the butcher knife. But it wasn't Epper who wrestled her to the tub floor, nor was it Epper who stabbed the detective who came to investigate Leigh's disappearance. Two other actresses committed those crimes.http://www.tcm.com/tcmdb/title/24944/Psycho/notes.htmlContemporary cast and crew sheets list a number of different doubles who portrayed Mother, and modern sources assert that Margo Epper was the main player used during the shower scene. Perkins appears as Mother only in the scene in which he attacks Lila.
May 9 13 10:13 AM
ryanbrennan wrote:I'm sure I've told this story elsewhere on the board but I'll tell it again. I used to know a woman whose father had been a propman at RKO since the early thirties. He worked props on Hitchcock's Mr. and Mrs. Smith. He told me that he became fearful of losing his job one day when he realized that he hadn't hung a framed picture that had figured prominently in an earlier shot from the same scene. He timidly approached the great director and prepared to be lambasted. Instead of being fired or dressed down he was (pleasantly) surprised when Hitchcock said, "My dear boy, if the audience is paying attention to that painting then I'm not doing my job."
I'm sure I've told this story elsewhere on the board but I'll tell it again. I used to know a woman whose father had been a propman at RKO since the early thirties. He worked props on Hitchcock's Mr. and Mrs. Smith. He told me that he became fearful of losing his job one day when he realized that he hadn't hung a framed picture that had figured prominently in an earlier shot from the same scene. He timidly approached the great director and prepared to be lambasted. Instead of being fired or dressed down he was (pleasantly) surprised when Hitchcock said, "My dear boy, if the audience is paying attention to that painting then I'm not doing my job."
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